|
Defence
committee for Rafay and Burns | Main
Rafay/Burns story | News
clippings scrapbook | Most
recent news items | Wilf
Hathway: Ensnared in similar sting | Acquitted after three
trials: Clayton Mentuck | Convicted: Jean
Paul Aubee | Gordon
Strowbridge | Christine
LePage |
Sebastian Burns
and Atif Rafay
- Chronological
Master List of Significant Entries (page one)
- Chronological
Master List of Significant Entries (page two)
- Chronological
Master List of Significant Entries (page three)
Components of the RCMP
Confession Coercion Strategy: How they entrap their suspects
Throughout the undercover
operation, the criminal personas of the officers established
the following facts and assert the following convictions:
- 1. They kill those who will
become informants.
- 2. If Burns is arrested, he
will become an informant.
- 3. If they do not prevent
his arrest, he will be arrested.
- 2 + 3 therefore A: if they
do not prevent arrest, he will become an informant.
- A + 1 therefore B: if they
do not prevent arrest, they will kill him.
- 4. Only if they know all the
details of the crime can they prevent his arrest.
- 5. Only if Burns can be trusted
they can prevent his arrest.
- 6. Only if Burns explicitly
confesses will they know the details of the crime.
- 7. Only if Burns explicitly
confesses can Burns be trusted.
- 4+5+6+7 therefore C: only
if Burns confesses can they prevent his arrest.
- Therefore D: if Burns does
not confess, they cannot prevent his arrest.
- B + D therefore if Burns
does not confess they will kill him.
There are, of course, several
alternate, simpler coercive systems established quite early on
in the scenarios (eg. 1. They kill those they assume will inform
on them, 2. they will assume he will inform unless he proves
his trustworthiness, 3. and he can only establish his trustworthiness
by confirming guilt.) but none are as prominent or aggressively
pursued by the officers as a decisive means to force a "confession".
The following pages contain
lists of transcript excerpts categorized by subject. This categorization
serves to show precisely how each excerpt contributes to the
overall coercion.
The first seven categories
contain excerpts specific to each of the components of the confession
coercion strategy. Several excerpts are included in more than
one list. This occurs most frequently in categories 4 - 7, as
the distinctions between them are fine and many remarks establish
all of these assertions in the same sentence.
A NOTE ON CATEGORY
DISTINCTIONS
It may seem unnecessary to
make a distinction between the criminal's necessity to know the
details of the crime, and the necessity for Burns to confess
in order to divulge those details, as the latter proposition
might seem to follow soundly from the former - indeed it might
seem unnecessary even to list evidential support for the latter
proposition at all. However previous counsel have found the explanation
of the RCMP's coercion baffling, and have submitted bizarre,
nonsensical interpretations that proceeded from unpredictable
(and seemingly impossible) misunderstandings. With respect to
these two particular components it is at least prudent to prove
in the former case that the criminals would not simply rely on
their own sources for information about the crime and make gratuitous
Burns's providing of the details, and in the latter case that
Burns could not have provided the details while maintaining innocence
or even merely refraining from making explicit inculpatory statements.
The most crucial objective
however, is to show how the sabotaging of the case was the only
avenue left to Burns if he wished to save his life. He wouldn't
live to be arrested or to stand trial, as arrest means turning
informant, and the potential to turn informant means death -
"dead men tell no tales. "
SHIFTS IN STRATEGY
There are distinct shifts in
strategy evident during the undercover scenarios that make clear
the intent of the undercover officers to increase the coerciveness
of the scenarios, if necessary until Burns has no choice but
to confess. In the first phase of the May 6, 1995 scenario, Gary
effectively offers millions of dollars in criminal revenues in
exchange for a confession, but less obviously he indicates concern
about Burns's reaction to the auto theft incident and to their
practices in general, emphasizes the absolute necessity that
they be able to "trust" Burns (ie. to be sure that
he won't inform on them) and expresses frustration with Burns
after Burns's exculpatory explanation of the allegations with
remarks like, "I sense something untrustworthy here."
This strategy in itself contains an implicit threat of death,
but Burns does not confess. (It could perhaps be argued that
at this stage Burns still had the option of confessing to a completely
different crime not that this would be any more sensical
or convenient than confessing falsely to the extant allegations.)
Officer Shinkaruk reaches a deadlock, one tidily articulated
by Burns who states, "...I don't know what the fuck I'm
supposed to say here..." (A54 - clearly sensing that he
is supposed to do or say something to assuage Gary's concerns.)
At this point Shinkaruk utters the code signal for Officer Haslett
to enter the room and begin a new strategy.
Haslett's strategy is essentially
to persuade Burns that the claims of innocence are implausible,
that Burns must be guilty, and that the police must have some
significant evidence against him. (Also, like Shinkaruk, he ignores
every assertion of Burns's disinterest in crime and continues
to pressure Burns to prove his trustworthiness, ostensibly to
qualify Burns for criminal employment.) Burns insists that he
is innocent and that the police are pestering him for lack of
any other suspects, and will not waver from this position. Haslett
finally acknowledges this, ("And you're getting fuckin'
sewered.") thereby marking the failure of the second strategy.
The third strategy begins a
few minutes later when Al states that he believes that Burns
will betray Al to the police if he is arrested. He states that
Burns is otherwise considered trustworthy because Al is certain
that Burns is guilty of the crime and as such has demonstrated
trustworthiness in non-arrest circumstances. With these remarks
Al makes explicit what Gary had been insinuating in the first
strategic phase. These disclosures preclude any further claims
of innocence on Burns's part, and in that sense achieve the first
step toward the ultimate coercion of a confession. Although Al
and Gary express strong confidence that Burns will be arrested,
they are not yet certain of this, but state that they will confirm
this through their police informants. They introduce the notion
of Burns sabotaging the police's case by eliminating evidence,
thereby insinuating that they are accustomed to doing this and
have the appropriate resources. At the end of this scenario,
Burns has effectively been made to understand that he will soon
be told by Al whether Burns poses a threat. to their organisation.
The blueprint has been laid for the strategy that cannot fail,
barring discovery by Burns that it is actually an undercover
operation. It closes with Al informing Burns that Burns will
deal drugs for Al, despite Burns repeated expressions of disinterest
in doing so.
In the remaining scenarios
the officers continue to use the third strategy, needing only
to fill in the coercive lacunae left by the May 6 encounter.
On May 28, Al asserts that his inside information has convinced
him that Burns will be arrested, and states that he needs to
know what occurred so that he can sabotage the case. Burns does
not deny guilt, (as was precluded on May 6) but attempts to provide
Al with a thorough list of potential evidence against him so
that Al might sabotage it. (Burns was later described in testimony
by Shinkaruk as confessing in a kind of code. This was offered
as justification for the lengthy duration of the pressure to
confess explicitly. Defense counsel did not observe that Burns
could not, at this point, have denied guilt because of the preceding
conversations, and thereby allowed the police to excuse their
conduct by their confidence that they would be able to obtain
a confession) All that is left for Haslett to do is to insist
that Burns' non-explicit answers are unacceptable, and Al will
abandon Burns if he does not comply. Burns finally does so, stating
to a friend who is similarly concerned about falsely confessing
that "...basically there's not really much choice but to
like forget about that kind of thing because... there's really
very little we can do at this point, so." (E7) This much
had been established on May 6.
USE OF THE
OFFICERS' FIRST NAMES IN THIS INDEX
Throughout most of this index
the undercover officers are referred to by their first names.
This is because the issue at hand is the effect of their actions
on Burns and Rafay, who perceived them to be murderous criminals.
The distinction in perception between their actions as undercover
officers and their actions as criminals is a problematic one,
and is so in a fashion detrimental solely to the defense, as
it impairs the suspension of disbelief necessary to understand
the coerciveness of their tactics. To Burns and Rafay, there
were no Haslett and Shinkaruk, only Al and Gary; Burns and Rafay
were going to die if they did not confess.
QUOTATION PORMAT
Quotes originating from a single
speaker on a single page that are documented as having been interrupted
in the RCMP transcript are separated by closed and reopened quotations.
Quotes that do not include all preceding or following sentences
originally allocated to same "speech bubble" will have
this omission marked with ellipsis periods. However, it should
be noted that some ellipsis periods will simply have been preserved
from the RCMP transcript. It is not known what signification
is intended by the use of ellipsis periods in the RCMP transcript.
INDEX OF UNDERCOVER
WIRETAP TRANSCRIPT SUBJECTS
Indices of transcript Excerpts
that demonstrate the following:
- 1.)
THE "CRIMINALS" KILL THOSE WHO WILL BECOME INFORMANTS
- 2.)
IF BURNS IS ARRESTED, HE WILL BECOME AN INFORMANT
- 3)
THE "CRIMINALS" BELIEVE BURNS AND RAFAY WILL BE ARRESTED,
BARRING PREVENTATIVE MEASURES
- 4)
THE "CRIMINALS" INSIST ON KNOWING THE DETAILS OF THE
CRIME BEFORE THEY WILL PREVENT ARREST
- 5)
THE "CRIMINALS" WILL PREVENT BURNS'S AND RAFAY'S ARREST
ONLY IF THEY TRUST THEM
- 6)
BURNS AND RAFAY MUST CONFESS TO PROVIDE THE CRIMINALS WITH THE
DETAILS OF THE CRIME
- 7)
BURNS AND RAFAY MUST CONFESS TO BE TRUSTED
- 8)
BURNS'S INDICATIONS OF DISINTEREST IN COMMITTING CRIMES
- 9)
BURNS' INABILITY TO COMMIT CRIMES
- 10)
THE "CRIMINALS"' UNSHAKEABLE CONVICTION OF BURNS'S
AND RAFAY'S GUILT
- 11)
BURNS FEELS OBLIGATED TO MAINTAIN THE ACQUAINTANCE AND COMMIT
CRIMES
- 12)
BURNS' ASSERTIONS OF HIS INNOCENCE
- 13)
BURNS' "IMPLICATIONS" OF INNOCENCE AFTER HE IS PRECLUDED
FROM EXPLICITLY STATING IT
- 14)
BURNS'S' DOUBTS ABOUT THE SOUNDNESS OF THE SABOTAGE PLAN
- 15)
THE "CRIMINALS"' CONCERN THAT RAFAY AND MIYOSHI WOULD
BECOME INFORMANTS
- 16)
THE "CRIMINALS"' RESOURCES AND INCLINATION TO KILL
TROUBLEMAKERS
- 17)
BURNS'S FEAR OF AL AND GARY
- 18)
AL'S RESEARCH ON BURNS
PACE REFERENCE
NOTATION
Transcript pages are notated
with a letter signifying a specific transcript followed by the
page number. The letters are assigned as follows:
A May 6, 1995. Four Seasons Hotel, Vancouver,
BC.
B June 28, 1995. Royal Scott Inn, Victoria, BC.
C July 18, 1995. Ocean Point
Hotel, Victoria, BC.
D July 19, 1995. Ocean Point
Hotel, Victoria, BC.
E July 26, 1995. Landis Hotel,
Vancouver, BC.
1.) THE "CRIMINALS"
KILL THOSE WHO WILL BECOME INFORMANTS
Transcript excerpts that show
that Al and Gary kill those who will become informants, or that
Burns believes this to be the case. It also includes excerpts
wherein Al indicates that he has permitted certain disclosures
to be made to Burns because of their confidence that Burns can
be killed.
A26 "...they can fuck up everything I care
about.... I'm gonna fuckin' do your wife and shit like that."
(Gary explains that they kill wives and families of objectionable
colleagues, and that in the scenario described it insured that
the victim of the crime would not attempt to press charges or
give evidence. Let us assume, for the purpose of assessing coercive
threats that having one's family or loved ones killed is equivalent
to having one's self killed.)
A27-28 Gary explains that his organization
kills potential informants, and describes and occasion wherein
he was charged with murder and was denied bail, but was ultimately
freed because the witness who had agreed to give (presumably
eyewitness) testimony against him was killed before the trial.
(See insert page containing portions of conversation occurring
during the change of tape sides (conspicuously) not transcribed
by the RCMP omission on A27.)
A88 Gary: " . ..not knowing that if you say
that, there's always that potential, shit hits the fan.... knowing
what I've done in the past..."
A89-90 "...or taking care of any fuckin'
buddies that will ever go to fuckin' court...." (Al explains
he doesn't "set people up" to go to jail - quite the
contrary - he'll kill people to keep he and his colleagues from
going to jail) "There's two things I ain't gonna fuckin'
do in my life, is go to jail or lose money. And you always remember
that."
A11/53 Al refers to having paid $80,000 for getting
Gary out of jail (by killing an informant by Gary's account)
and then states "That's why it's a not a fuckin' act! I
don't give a fuck what you know!"
B71 BURNS: "...if I were to fuck you around,
okay, I would just assume that I would, with or without a bullet
in my head (poor transcription) ... that is the power you have
over me.... I'm not going to fuck you around for that very goddamn
reason.... if I were to do something to you, anything, try and,
like set you up or whatever that I would be fucked.... . . .
if I went to jail or something I'm sure I still could be gotten
to...."
B76 BURNS: "...what am I gonna do, like oh
yeah he toasted a guy, like you know, it's a day late, ya know,
I'm, I'm dead in my bed kinda thing. Like obviously ya know,
he just says what he fuckin' feels like." (Burns refers
to the open remarks Gary makes about murders he's committed because
of his secure knowledge that if Burns does not prove to be trustable,
he will be murdered.)
B94 Al uses a "well" metaphor and refers
to people "smelling the heat," and then, "It pays
to be fuckin' sharp. Always fuckin' people killed."
B107 Al has explained that if Burns "goes down,"
then Al will "go down." He then says, "And I can't
afford to have me to go fuckin' down," to which Burns says,
"Yeah, I know but you're not gonna go down, because theoretically
speaking if you go down I'm dead (LAUGHS) so therefore you never
go down, that's your power."
B114 Al: 'I... I don't give two fucks whether you
trust me or not. I fuckin' uh, I got your fuckin' uh, basically
your fuckin' future in the palm of my fuckin' hand if I want
it anyway but you're gonna make money for me..."
B117 Al explains he is looking after himself first,
and Burns second, only because Burns can earn money for Al. He
then says, "But don't fuckin sell me short, and don't ever
let your fuckin' friends start selling me short, 'cause you start
selling me short, you'll be in the (INDECIPHERABLE) hurt..."
C52 Burns: "...you could just confidently think
well those guys wouldn't fuck me around because they'd know that
you know they'd be dead as soon as fuckin' two days after they
did..." (NB there is a portion of the recording on this
same page which would contain some preceding remarks by Burns
about this same subject that was not transcribed by the RCMP,
ostensibly because of a tape side change)
2.) IF BURNS
IS ARRESTED, HE WILL BECOME AN INFORMANT
Transcript excerpts that show
that Al and Gary are convinced that Burns will become an informant
if arrested and that all who are arrested become informants.
A49 Gary insists to Burns that "the same fuckin'
level of trust has to be there at both ends... and that's what
it comes down to is, it's, it's too far to, too far to fall and,
and to me the, the ultimate..." He feels that he is at risk
to take a fall because of Burns, and that this situation is unacceptable.
A74 "The thing is Sebastian, nothing's coming
down on us, me, because you're either gonna fuckin' work for
me, and fuckin' get involved making money and it'll be total
trust, where you don't fuck me, and I don't fuck you." (Offers
no alternative.)
A79-80 Burns says that he is too busy to commit
crimes and that he would seem to be unqualified according to
Al's standard, to which Al says that Burns must show Al that
he is capable. Burns makes a last objection that is undeciphered
by the RCMP, to which Al says, "What happens when these
fuckin' auh bozos from down auh in Bellevue, come fuckin' up
here and grab you?" "Whose the first person you're
gonna give up?" "Well you're looking at him, that's
why I want to be fuckin' sure..." Burns denies that he would
ever turn Al in, to which Al says, "Not today you don't,
but in a three months you might." When Burns is reluctant
to answer questions, Al no longer offers explanations for his
curiosity, instead ordering "Tell me about it!"
A84 Al: "I just want to fuckin' see if you're
competent, cause Gary told me, you had some concerns (about the
auto theft and last meeting) and I just want to be sure auh,
you concerns are gonna cause me fuckin' problems."
A85-87 Al and Gary learn that Burns took Gary's license
plate number and conclude that he must have done that in order
to turn them in, in the event that he was arrested. Al is enraged
and Gary is shocked, both behaving as though Burns might be terminated
then and there. Both display every indication of believing Burns
to be an informer who should be killed.
A89 Al: "'Cause the minute I get a fuckin'
(INDECIPHERABLE) people that are working for me are going to
fuckin' jail... I got... a chance of me going to jail. "
A9/53 Gary: "...obviously, ah whatever's ah,
whatever you saw, saw whatever you didn't see here. You didn't
see here and ah, the reason I worry scares us and ah , they're
gonna be up to . . . business is business don't fuck . . . business
"
A17/53 Al : "But I'm not sure if you can be fuckin'
trusted." Burns's eventual response to this is to explain
that he would never become an informant.
B70 Al: "I'm asking you [about the allegations]
for one reason, to protect my own ass...."
B71 Al explains that Burns's lack of cooperation
may cause someone to charged with a crime. He then explains,
"And nobody that works for me is going to get bit. If they
get bit I get bit. You know what I mean?" (The implication
being that the charged party would inform on Al.)
B73 Al: "'Cause if they get bit in the ass,
I get bit in the ass.... I get bit in the ass, it hurts."
B83 Al: "I'll help you, but I won't help you
unless you fuckin' uh, don't play games with me 'cause I will
not be set,..." I'... I will not be setup by anybody."
Burns: "(Sighs) Gees, I'm not setting you up!"
B95 Al: "My ass ain't gonna get bit man...."
"You got Gary's pager number now. Even though I don't like
it, Gary's num, pager will be fuckin' thrown in the fuckin' ocean
and that'll be the end,of it." (The transcription may be
inaccurate here, but in either case the correct inference is
"If I don't like it..." as opposed to "Even though
I don't like it.")
B106-107 Al: "And you take a fall, you
know who else takes a fall after everything's done, Guess (sic),
right now, guess."
Burns: "No one."
Al: "What do you mean no one?"
Burns: "No one."
Al: "Huh? No one? You're fuckin' stupid right now, you know
who else goes down."
Burns: "You're gonna say you, right?"
Al: "Yeah."
B107 Al: "And I can't afford to have me to go
fuckin' down."
B113 Al: "I'm gonna look after whoever who's
ever fucking was involved in this fucking murder, because everything
comes back to me, and back to you."
B116 Al: "...if he ends up going down because
I missed something, you're gonna go down anyway, and you go down
and fuck you know me I'm goin' down."
B117 Al explains he is looking after himself first,
and Burns second, only because Burns can earn money for Al. He
then says, "But don't fuckin sell me short, and don't ever
let your fuckin' friends start selling me short, 'cause you start
selling me short, you'll be in the (INDECIPHERABLE) hurt...."
D31 Al: "Anybody works for me gets in trouble,
I couldn't fuckin' imagine how much trouble I'd be in if someone
got me in trouble I would lose everything I got, and that's a
loss."
3.) IF THEY
DO NOT PREVENT BURNS' ARREST, HE WILL BE ARRESTED.
A8/53 Al: "You obviously left somethin' down
there that's fuckin' ah, people are asking for." "They
want your fuckin' ass for some reason." "Exactly some
potential thing somethin' that helps and I'll find out..."
A18/53 Al: "You left something behind down there."
A19/53 Al: "Was the lead
down there? You have to think" "Everything I read,
they have somethin' on you."
A20/53 Al: " . ..They're saying, they have something
there."
A30/53 Gary: "...I just like dealing . . . you
know and ah, somehow I'll say one thing, and you say another
thing but it ain't 52 cards that's been fuckin' played over here..."
Al:. "What kind of evidence is there down there against
you?"
A32/53 Gary: "Can't your lawyer just phone down
and say fuck if ah, my guy crosses the line are you gonna pick
him up? They won't tell him-."
Burns: "Wel-well basically they said they will and-"
Gary: "-then I would say you're not safe."
A33/53 Al: "What kinda evidence, what what's evidence
from it. What kind of evidence did you leave?" "Yeah,
you left fuckin' something down there that ah, is going to tie
you to a fuckin' ah, murder."
A34/53 Al: "That's why they're after you, fuckin'
think." "-when read you this fuckin' murder you left
something behind, that they're after. That's why the fuck they're
after you. Stop and think, that's what it's all about."
"Um, is that's they way that's great 'cause that's what's
happening, that's what they're thinking. That's how you got into
your fuckin' . . . covers man. Somethin' was left. Stop and think."
Gary: " . ..Sounds like you're saying that something fuckin'
they left their house, saying there's something there?..."
(Burns is trying to convince them that there is no reason to
believe that there is any physical evidence against him)
A35/53 Gary: "They (the police) ain't gonna fuckin'
be sittin' there chasing down something, that ain't there. And
you do what the fuck you want, if it's there, you get rid of
it. That's that's the pure and simple you should do and ah, otherwise
ah-ah', I-I been that fuckin' route man and as long as I've been
sitting there, they're (accused parties that claimed innocence)
still doing time, I-, there's a fuckin' there's a trail, you
fuckin' cover it up. Ah do what the fuck you want, she's your
life.
Burns: "Well yeah okay, anyhow."
Gary: "Did you here what I said, don't give me this fuckin'
anyhow...."
B62 Al: "Well, they have you in a pretty big
fucking way down there... the report I read knows you did it."
Al goes on to explain the supposed forensic evidence and the
supposed meaning of this.
B64 Al elaborates on the forensic evidence.
B68 Al: "...And once it's
looked after 'we'll talk again and then you'll know you're clear.
They're culturing your fuckin' D.N.A. is the word they used right
now."
B71 Al: "Right now you need my fuckin' help."
B77 Al: (After Burns begins
to speculate on the scenario in the police's theory of the crime)
"Let's forget about this scenario, they know you killed
him. That's in the report is fuckin' . . ..that report is so
fuckin' uh, white whatever, so clear, it's unreal."
B95 Al: 'I... 'Cause right now your ass is bit big..."
B98 Al: 'I... 'cause you're the one that's gonna
be hung out to dry here right now unless someone helps you."
B101 Al: It . ..It's not as though, I know you fuckin'
did it. You know you did it. The police even fuck know you did
it..."
B105 Al: "And then you're the one hanging out
here to fuckin' dry.... Tell you something right fuckin' now,
the way it is now you're done down there."
B109 Al : "...the report, report I read on you
was so fuckin' black and fuckin' white it's unreal..."
B114 Al: "...I don't give two fucks whether
you trust me or not. I fuckin' got your fuckin' uh, basically
your future in the palm of my fuckin' hand if I want it anyway...."
B115 Al: "...The report I read fuckin' puts
you there. You know that, I know that."
B116 Al: "...if he ends up going down because
I missed something, and you're gonna go down anyway, and you
go down..." ("and fuck you know me I'm goin' down.")
C9 Al: "...they're fuckin' coming to lock
your ass up. Yours and your friends (sic)."
Cl4 Al: 'I... he says there's things down there
they're coming to lock your ass up. Yours and your friend. He
said things got to be acted on fast if they're gonna 'be acted
on. . . . there's no time for any mistakes here. 'cause I'll
tell you right now, it's this close..."
Cl8 Al: "...It's gonna fuckin' make a little
bit of sense, it's gonna save you and fuckin' your friend's ass
from jail..."
C31 Al: ,"There's a little plan that's gonna
be in motion here, it's gotta be happening in the next fuckin'
short while because as I told you they are fuckin' putting things
together down there, then they'll come up here and fuckin' arrest
both you guys's ass . ...'
D32 Al: (to Rafay): "You and Sebastian are
in a little bit of trouble.... In fact you and him are so close
to going to jail right now it's fuckin' unreal, and I know that
because of different things I know and I've read...."
4.) THEY MUST
KNOW THE DETAILS OF THE CRIME TO PREVENT BURNS'S AND RAFAY'S
ARREST
Transcript excerpts that show
that Al and Gary are convinced that they cannot and in any case
will not sabotage the case against Burns unless they are satisfied
that they know the complete details of the crime.
A18/53 Al: "You got problems in the States, I
have no idea if I could ever fuckin' help you out down there.
I know if you're (probably your) fuckin' fact I can make-, some
people fuckin' try to find out 'cause I'm down there.... Till
I know what's going on down there I don't know-, you tell me
what's going on down there, that's what I'm asking you.... What
went on down there, what went on down there? You tell me, I'll
be able to fuckin' find out a lot more. Last thing I wanna do
is go fishing around."
A20-21/53 Al: 'I... But the last thing I-, is
go askin' questions blindly."
Burns: "Listen, you know as much as I do, about-, . . .
there's nothing I can say that can help you if you don't-."
Al: "No but I-I don't want to question blindly,"
A31/53 Al: " 'cause if I wanna fuckin' find out
I'll pay money to find out." "And so what? What are
we find out, what kind of -'
B66 Al: "What went on down there that I got-that
I got to fuckin' worry about covering up for you and destroying
for you.... How did that hair get in the shower with the blood
in... . . ..let's be straight forward with each other right now
because I've got some other things in motion that are going to
look after you, if in fact things start working out between you
and I. They don't, that's the end. But what, what do I have to
worry about what else that's gonna come back and bite you in
the ass? . . ..Tell me about the shower (etc. etc.) . . ..You
know why, 'cause I gotta know what else I got to take care of.
That is why."
B67 Al: "Now before he goes askin' around in
the fuckin' dark getting more. I wanna know. . . ..you were there
I fuckin' wasn't now this-this is no time toplay games."
(He explains further that he needs to know precisely what to
look for and cannot waste the opportunity by simply making enquiries.)
B68 Al: "Be straight with me and I can look
after you. Don't be straight with me and I can not fuckin' look
after you." (Later in the page he reiterates that his saboteur
cannot make the several trips required to find more information,
as they wish to use their opportunity to sabotage the evidence
in "one shot".)
B69 Al: (Asks detailed questions) "Because
I want to know what the fuck went on. Did you wash the murder
weapon in there or what the fuck went on here? That's what I
wanna fuckin' know. So when I go back to this fuckin' lab they
don't start fuckin' havin, weapons go missing or what."
B70 Al: "Well, when he goes back and asks,
well I'm trying to look after you, if you don't want looked after
tell me so. (Asks specific questions) . . . . If you can't tell
me that then it makes me think you're hiding other stuff that
when I go down there I get fuckin' half the story and I'm gonna
be coming out with half a fuckin' answer."
B71 Al: "I.., somebody down there or somebody
in someplace when I ask them to do something for isn't going
to be stickin' their fuckin' neck in the dark. You know what
it's like going out with your head in the dark and only knowing
half the fuckin' story you're trying to find something out. Somebody
get fuckin' bit..."
B72 Al: "... 'Cause now you'll know exactly
how I'm going to help you. Why don't you tell me that so I get
the fuckin' story so I make sure when somebody fuckin' goes in
there once and does what they gotta do, he ain't gonna go back
the second time for something that I don't know about."
"...they're not going in there dark..."
B73 Al: "...So let's be straight forward with
each other as much as we can right now and we decide at the end
if we're gonna fuckin' answer more questions you're gonna fill
in the more blanks for me, okay? 'Cause I'm not sending people
down there in the dark."
B75 Al: "...No, just give me some idea what
I'm lookin' at when you're saying you're [sic - homonym] hairs
on the bodies of 'em."
B77 Al asks detailed questions about the forensic
evidence.
B78 Al: "So fuckin' be straight forward with
me. That's all I want." Al continues to ask detailed questions.
'I... I just wanna know so I know what I'm lookin' at when I
go in there... I'm not fuckin' gonna in there dark okay?"
"If I was there I'll tell ya right now I'd have all these
answers and I'd be knowin' what the fuck to do."
B79 Al: " ...tell me the bit about the showers,
just give me that and I'll leave it alone. And 1'11 talk to,
find out what else I'll come back ask ya more." "...did
you wash the fuckin' weapon in the shower? That's all I wanna
know. Like fuck, am I lookin' for some other fuckin' uh weapons
or somethin', that's all I wanna know..." "Picture
this. I go back to a certain individual, I say here's what I
want. I wanna know if there's Sebastian's hair on these bodies."
B86 Al: "I'm not fuckin' having' my people
go down there blind." "So I, I got some questions about
that I, I'm thinking of I know they're you're gonna ask me and
I, uh I don't have a lot of time to fuckin', back and forth,
back and forth 'cause I know right now all you do with this is
one time. 'Cause they're not going to be able to go back twice.
'Cause once things are done it's done." "...Those things
I gotta know. How about your clothes like these are fuckin' things
that this fuckin' guy ask me a few questions, I said well fuck
I don't know."
B87 Al: "You ain't give me the straight goods
here Sebastian. What makes you think someone's goin' into the
fuckin' dark?..."
B89 Al: "Then fuckin' start comin' straight forward
with me [if you want my help ]."
B93 Al: "Don't be so fuckin' evasive with me,
tell me. It's no big fuckin' deal to me. But I don't fuckin'
want someone's fuckin' ass getting' bit."
B94 Burns asks why Al is demanding specific details.
Al: "The next report I read I wanna be fuckin' sure that
everything's covered." Al says he doesn't want to "go
back to the well".
B95 Al: "...I will not be able to keep fuckin',
I will not have people go back." "...I will not fuckin'
have these guys go back. For the reason is, 'cause I will not
lose my credibility. And look like a fuckin' buffoon of who's,
who's and two... If you want to sit there and play coy with me,
I tried to not fuckin'. I don't have time to make any mistakes.
The minute I fuckin' makes this mistake being made you won't
fuckin' hear from me again."
B107 Al: ".... Now, I'm gonna do what I can,
just one little thing - when I go back down there and start fuckin'
asking to other people to do what they gonna do. They shouldn't
be looking for any other reports on D.N.A. on these other two
guys?"
B108-109 Al hectors Burns for specific information.
Al: "A simple yes or no because I'll tell you right now,
I'm not gonna go down there and start fuckin' looking for more
files than I have to." Al asks for more specific details,
e.g. "I want to know is his hair gonna be on these fuckin'
dead bodies..." "Oh I'll check but it's just gonna
take more time than anything else but I want to know what I'm
fuckin' asking about what I'm doing, I'don't want to look like
a fuckin' retard when I start asking these questions."
B109 Al: " Now, do I gotta go him and start
searching other files there might something else on him, that's,
see what I'm saying?" "Now was he there or did you
just, just answer me this, did you do this alone and I'll know
what I'm looking at." "Why don't you answer my question,
I just want a yes or no and then I'll forget about it and then
I'll know I won't go after seven thousand files."
B110: Al: "...let me paint you this picture I
gotta go to someone who I pay money to, who fuckin' uh, does
as I ask, I got to to (sic) to him and say look remember the
report you showed me, I want all the detail for these different
reasons, I want more on it, I want you to get what you can, and
I'm gonna say look there's another individual who might be involved,
can you search all these files for him, he's only gonna say,
what the fuck do you mean might, Al?." "Well then he
goes through all this other process and fuckin' finds out that
he wasn't, then who do I look like there a real fuckin' invisible
o'tool that goes with sending, that goes with sending people
in the dark."
B112 Al : "Okay but were you alone or not, that's
all, answer that fuckin' question I'll answer once in my mind,
i.e. what the fuck I'll be looking for. If you're alone I'm only
looking after your ass right now." "When I leave here
I don't want any grey shit."
B113 Al: "...But, if someone else was with you
then I fuckin' have to start asking a few more questions that
are gonna make me look more intelligent and they're gonna make
someone think this fuckin' guy knows fuckin' quite a bit, I'm
gonna fuckin' earn my money and be sure I got everything. If
I go in there and ask only fuckin' grey questions, and he comes
back and says, uh, here's what I got, and I don't know the answers
then I've been fuckin' snowed, see what I'm saying?"
B115 Al: "...I don't want to to (sic) in there
fuckin' grey when I ask for a simple fuckin' thing on someone
else, and I can't fuckin' give them a fuckin' thing like yeah,
he's fuckin' uh, he was there to find out exactly, pursue it
fuckin' further so you know exactly what got about him. I don't
him gonna in there fuckin' half assed when I tell him oh fuck
yeah he might have been around the house there but I don't think
he was there when the fuckin' dirty deed happened yeah, so he
only does fuckin' half the job thinking well fuck
the guy doesn't know anything. If I go back and I say yeah fuck
he was there, I know he was there, let's fine (sic) out exactly
what the fuck they got about him?" "Fuck all on Atif,
right. Okay now, did this guy not look fuckin' far enough or
is it fuckin' that they are concentrating on you so bad they
got so much against you they don't give two fucks about this
Atif?"
B116 Al: "And I leave here with a clear fuckin'
mind I know exactly I'm fuckin' lookin' after one guy's ass to
protect or we go to the fuckin' lab, there's one guy fuckin'
being looked after I'm not fuckin' uh, protecting fuckin' three
guys, two guys or one guy, I'm protecting you." Al states
that he has to know about everyone without priority because if
any details are missed, then his operative will go down, and
Al will go down himself because Burns will inform on him.
B117 Al: "I only asked you a fuckin' question,
don't fucking play fuckin round-about games with me, you know.
I ask questions because I fucking want to have clear answers
to fucking look after..." 'I... But fuckin' don't sell me
short..."
C9 Al: "...there's uh, things here that can
be done very fucking quickly and very easy things, but they gotta
be done quick. But you're gonna want to do them, you're gonna
have to tell me you want them done, and you're gonna have to
play straight with me, 'cause things are fuckin' happening quick
here now... And, there's too many questions that are unanswered
here right now... It's your call, there's too many thing that
are unanswered right now....So..." "...What I'm saying
is a lot of things are not answered, or answered here..."
C12 Burns indicates confusion over contents of police
report. Al: "Well, I don't know, you were there, I can't,
like if I knew I could fuckin' probably tell you, I don't know,
and I can't start asking all these questions." "Until
I fuckin' know. And that's the bottom line."
C13-14 Al: "I'll tell you why it (Burns's non-inculpatory
and hence, to Al, incomplete remarks about the evidence) doesn't
stand as far as I'm concerned." "...I had someone doing
some checks for me, pissed off when he comes out, next thing
I know this fuckin' guy gets a hold of me, I'm meeting him, he
shows me this. He says look, he's supposed to be looking for
a few fuckin' hairs and anything else, and he comes up with..."
"...and then he comes , and he comes up with this stuff
here and he says hey unless I better what I'm looking for he
says you better fuckin' come down here and fuckin' give me the
facts cause I'm not fuckin' lookin' no more and uh, so now these..."
C14 Al: "...I'm not fuckin'
going and telling him to do anything else now, half the job and
blind because there's no time for any mistakes here..."
Cl5 Al: "...I'11 tell you why [a specific detail]
matters, because forget about what the fuckin' police have in
these reports for right now. What we have to deal with is getting
this stuff out of the lab." "...I'm not gonna risk
first of all anything with me, without knowing what I'm doing
anymore, and obviously there's another person that I'm looking
after one thousand percent here and it's fucking not gonna fuckin'
do anything for me unless he's got fucking everything he knows
he's looking for. Like could you imagine if we went to the lab
and just changed some things around and all of a sudden we're
fuckin' uh, dealing with some fuckin' uh, red fabric hairs that
we didn't find?" "So I want to know right now."
Cl6 Al: "...So, tell me what went on down there
and I'm gonna tell you how I'm gonna take care of your problem.
Okay and it has to be taken care of quick. Give me the straight
goods, so I know exactly what I gotta take care of. Now if something
else needs taking care of I'm gonna need your help. Start."
Cl7 Al asks for extremely specific information and
Burns answers with supposedly incriminating information and inculpatory
remarks. "Confession" begins.
Cl8 Al: "...So I want you to start thinking
fuckin' smart, because everything you tell me now I'm gonna tell
you how we're gonna handle this. It's gonna fuckin' make a little
bit of sense, it's gonna save you and fuckin' your friend's ass
from jail."
C28-29 Al: "Well fuck see I didn't know that either.
See fuckin', you're holding fucking things out on me..."
"But I gotta know this stuff, 'cause if all of a sudden
uh, someone says to me down there fuck I got this report where
they found a pair of jeans in a fuckin' dumpster, 1'11 think
holy fuck..." "...It's little details like that are
gonna fuck us up in the end. You see what I'm saying, you see
why I get a little pissed off?"
C29 Al (continuing): "'Cause I can't afford
fuck ups."
C36 Al states that one lab, which contains all the
evidence, will be sabotaged. He then says, "Right now, I
only know of one. That's with all your hair with the uh, blood
and that's why I was wondering, making sure they didn't have
your clothes and this fuckin' murder weapon. If you can guarantee
me they haven't got those then I only have to worry about one
lab right now."
5. WILL ONLY
SABOTAGE THE CASE IF BURNS IS TRUSTWORTHY
Transcript excerpts that show
that Al will not sabotage the case unless Burns is trustworthy
in non-arrest circumstances, and that in general Burns must be
trustworthy for Al and Gary to have any involvement with Burns.
(If the case becomes that Burns is to be arrested, he is, of
course, necessarily not trustworthy as per section 2.) Once the
sabotage plan has been suggested, any references implied or otherwise
to concerns about trust effectively show that Al will only arrange
for the sabotage of the case if Burns can be trusted.
A74 Al: "The thing is Sebastian, nothin's coming
down on us, me, because you're either gonna fuckin' work for
me, and fuckin' get involved making money and it'll be total
fuckin' trust, where you don't fuck me, and I don't fuck you....
That's what's gonna be (INDECIPHERABLE) is total, one thousand
percent"
A89 The passage is largely indecipherable but Al
seems to indicate that only if Burns is properly trusted and
making money for Al "I will look after you one thousand
percent."
B66 Al: "Um, let's be straight forward with
each other right now because I've got some other things in motion
here, that are gonna look after you, if in fact, things start
working out between you and I. They don't, that's the end."
B68 Al: "I told you before I'll look after
everybody who works for me and I'll spend money to look after
them while we're there truthful and fuckin' straight forward
with me. If they're not I am not going to stick my fuckin' neck
in the dark." "... If I'm gonna go down there and fuckin'
look after you so you'll be able to work for me and make me money,
I wanna know. . . . But I cannot fuckin' do it without having
you on my side so that if one thing happens I'm looked after..."
B80 Al: "Answer me this. Why did you guys do
this? Money?" "'Cause I just wanna know, I wanna know
what kind of guys I'm going to be workin' with..."
B81 Al: "Let's fuckin' worry about you not goin'
to fuckin' jail, but why you do it is for my peace of mind."
B83 Al: "It's pretty serious shit man."
"I'll help you, but I won't help you unless you fuckin'
uh, don't play games with me 'cause I will not be set..."
"...I will not be set up by anybody."
B89 Al tells Burns not to be a "smart-ass"
"'Cause 1'11 just walk away in a fuckin' heartbeat. If I
don't fuckin' like the feeling of it." "And I won't
fuckin' care of fuckin' Sebastian BURNS."
B114 Al asks for a yes or no answer about the details
of the crime and Burns says that the details aren't important
whereas the forensic scientist's interpretation of the crime
scene is, and for that reason yes or no answers would not necessarily
be of assistance, to which Al says "You know what though,
when you don't answer that question it makes me think that you
don't trust me." Al later explains that he doesn't care
whether Burns trusts him, although clearly he means he doesn't
care except to the extent that such a
lack of trust indicates Burns's own untrustworthiness.
B117 Al: "...But don't fuckin' sell me short,
and don't ever let your fuckin' friends start selling me short,
'cause you start selling me short, you'll be in the (INDECIPHERABLE)
hurt, especially with what you know about yourself right now."
C9 Al: "But there's uh, things here that can
be done very fucking quickly and very easy things, but they gotta
be done quick. But, you're gonna want to do them, you're gonna
have to tell me you want them done, and you're gonna have to
play straight with me, 'cause things are fuckin' happening quick
here now. But, it can't be done without you fuckin' saying you
want it done..."
C53 Al: "And I'm smart enough to make sure
I'll find out about them (Rafay and Miyoshi) before, see."
" But those are two things in my mind that I just, I gotta
be sure I check 'em..."
D15 Al: "...That's why Atif better be fuckin'
solid. If I don't think he is, I'm out of here."
D31 Al (to Rafay): "Without any trust we'll
never be able to work together. Do you understand that."
"[People whom I don't trust] they'll never fuckin' work
for me again and they'll never fuckin' make a dime off me. And
I'll never fuckin' look after them. That's the bottom line here..."
D35 Al: "...he (Burns) told me some stuff and
I'm curious about a lot of things but I'm curious about, the
biggest thing is trust." 'I... I want to be sure he (Burns)
can trust you and want to be one thousand percent sure that I
can trust you."
D36 Al (to Rafay): "My concern is here, can
you be trusted." "That's why I gotta be sure you are
solid."
E2 Al: "...uh the biggest thing is I gotta
be sure I can trust you because uh, there's a lot of things on
my mind that... trust is everything, if you haven't got fuckin'
trust we're gonna be... never do business together, see what
I mean?" "Uh, once I do that, that's when the total
trust's gonna have to come into play and I want to be sure you
can trusted."
E4 Al: "...I'll tell you the reason I'm asking
is I gotta be sure you can be trusted." "...If I can't
trust you I can't trust any body 'cause you're involved with
me right now and, when Sebastian explains to you what I'm gonna
be doing for him and Atif, then you'll see how you're gonna,
I'm gonna be involved. And I gotta be sure I can trust all three
of you."
E9 Al : "...everything's being looked after
here, it'll be looked after within uh, next three or four weeks.
If I feel comfortable with everything. That's why I want to talk
to you (Miyoshi), make sure I feel comfortable with everything."
6. MUST CONFESS
IN ORDER TO PROVIDE DETAILS
Transcript excepts that show
that Al is convinced that he will not have the complete details
of the crime if Burns does not make explicitly inculpatory remarks.
A20-21/53 Al: "Be candid with me and tell
me why you did it. And I can fuckin'-, sure like to find out.
But the last thing I-, is go askin' questions blindly."
B66 Al: "What went on down there that I got-that
I got to fuckin' worry about covering up for you and destroying
for you." Al then asks how "that" hair got in
the shower. He later says, " . ..let's be straight forward
with each other right now because I've got some other things
in motion here, that are gonna look after you, if in fact, things
start working out between you and I. They don't, that's the end.
But what, what do I have to worry about what else that's gonna
come back and bite you in the ass?" He then asks Burns
to tell him about the shower and to explain how blood came to
be in the shower. Burns objects, eventually saying, "I can't
say anything that'll help you..." Al: "Yeah, you can.
You know why, 'cause I gotta know what else I got to take care
of. That's why."
B67-8 Al: "How did this blood get in the shower
for starters? Did you wash out the fuckin' murder weapon in it
or what? That's what I want to fuckin' find out. Be straight
with me and I can fuckin' maybe look after you. Don't be straight
with me I can not fuckin' look after you. I told you before I'll
look after everybody who works for me and I'll spend more money
to look after them while we're there truthful and fuckin' straight
forward with me. If they're not I am not going to stick my fuckin'
neck in the dark."
B68 Burns suggests that the important details could
be gleaned from police reports and television reports. Al: "You
were there, I wasn't. I'm getting too fucked with the police
telling you to fuck your head. I'm getting too fucked with the
fuckin' t.v. tells ya to, uh, make fuckin' money off a t.v. If
I'm gonna go down there and fuckin' look after you so you'll
be able to work for me and make me money, I wanna know. 'Cause
like I said, I will not be going fuckin' back and I can not fuckin'
risk going back two or three times, start fuckin' askin for little
bits of information every fuckin' week or two or three weeks.
It's gonna come out in one fuckin' shot. It'll be taken care
of in one shot... Nobody in their right mind's gonna keep going
back fuckin' day in and day out. And that's what I gotta fuckin'
know... Now what the fuck went on down there so I can go look
after everything fully?"
B69 Al asks Burns how his hair came to be in the
shower mixed with blood.
Burns: "Well I guess at some point I must've been in the
shower and, uh, at
some point there was blood in the shower and, uh,"
Al: "Forget about it fuckin', you're fuckin' makin' circles.
I didn't come down on last night's train. How did the dead people's
blood get in the fuckin' shower with your hair?"
B70 Al: "How did your hair and blood get in
the shower?" "If you can't tell me that then it makes
me think you're hiding other stuff that when I go down there
I get fuckin' half the story and I'm gonna be coming out with
half a fuckin' answer."
B72 Al: "It's time you were straight with me
and I'm straight with you and I'll tell you if I'm gonna help
you once I got the whole story. 'Cause now you'll know exactly
how I'm going to help you. Why don't you tell me that so I get
the fuckin' story so I make sure when somebody fuckin' goes in
there once and does what they gotta do, he ain't gotta go back
the second time for something that I don't know about."
B72-73 Al: "I want it fuckin' clear so it's no
big fuckin' lingo on it so I know when I ask a question I'm askin'
you cause I fuckin' wanna know. So let's be straight forward
with each other as much as we can right now and we decide at
the end if we're gonna fuckin' answer more questions you're gonna
fill in more blanks for me, okay? 'Cause I'm not sending people
down there dark."
B73 Al: "Should your hair be there? What did
you do? I want to know. Like, how many reports do I got to look
for?"
B75 Al: "How did ya kill these guys? No, just give
me some idea what I'm lookin' at when you're saying you're hairs
on the bodies of 'em." Al asks for specific details. "If
ya want my help, you're gonna have to fuckin' come forward with
me." " . ..when I fuckin' ask you how you killed those
guys you can not fuckin' say uh, the medical report."
B77 Al asks questions about details of the evidence
that require inculpatory explanations. Burns: " . ..lf there
[sic] scenario is that, ya know Sebastian has killed someone..."
Al: "Let's forget about this scenario, they know you killed
him. That's in the report is fuckin'. Gary was talkin' about
green and black. That in, that report is so fuckin' uh, white
whatever, so clear, it's unreal."
B78 Al asks questions about details of the evidence
that require inculpatory explanations.
B79 Again, Al asks questions about details of the
evidence that require inculpatory
explanations.
B86 Burns answers "not to my knowledge"
to a specific question, and Al replies "What do you mean
not to your knowledge you were fuckin' there don't give me the
fuckin' games okay."
B87 Al: "You ain't giving me the straight goods
here Sebastian." He demands answers which would necessarily
be inculpatory. When Burns gives non-inculpatory answers, Al
says "Okay. Stop the fuckin' bullshit there. Stop the bullshit
there. Right now you're all but fuckin' lying to me."
B88 Burns provides an innocent explanation for the
existence of physical evidence. Al: "You are fuckin' givin'
me this song and dance and everything you just told me. That
you told me last time I talked to you that, which I don't know
fuck all about. You come back and found these fuckin' bodies.
You found them, the report I fuckin' read. Fuckin' basically
spells out black and white. That, the police fuckin' know you
killed these people. The fuckin' DNA is being cultured right
now and they're puttin' together fuckin', big fuckin' case against
you. So I'm not gonna have this bullshit, you lying to me now,
or fuckin' uh, you come back and found these fuckin' bodies.
You must think I come down on last night's train. The minute
you start thinkin' that about me..." "...make it clear
so I don't misunderstand you because I'm not havin' fuckin my
ass get bit here."
Burns says, "...to be civil, tell your friends to check
to see..."
Al: "You be civil with me. Don't fuckin' lie to me. Don't
take me for a fuckin' stupid man."
Burns: "I'm not takin' you for a stupid man."
Al: "You're always started telllin' me you come back and
found these
bodies that I fuckin' know for a fact..." Burns says that
the evidence is not compelling, but that it is worthwhile checking
if it could be misrepresented as incriminating.
Al: "Don't be a smart ass with me man."
B89 Al: "[If you want me to help you] Then
fuckin' start comin' straight forward with me." "I
will not havin' somebody fuckin' get their ass bit off."
B93-94 Al: "Well, what did you use? So now you
look at me with that holy fuck he's up to somethin' heavy. You
know why I ask these questions?" "The next report I
read I wanna be fuckin' sure that everything's covered."
"That's why I want to fuckin' know." "Just give
me whatever you can give me and don't fuck me around." "And
don't take me for an idiot"
B95 Al: "And you know I know your ass is fucked
helped and I'm here to fuckin' help you. If you want to sit there
and play coy with me, I tried not fuckin'. I don't'have time
to make any mistakes. The minute I fuckin' make this mistake
being made you won't fuckin' hear from me again." "Well
for some reason you're holding back on me and I don't know why."
Burns tries to convince Al that the questions he resists do not
matter. Al: "You know what you're not saying? You're not
saying how you killed them, Fuck knows
how that blood got in the shower, I do not know how that blood
got in the
shower."
B96 Al: "Those . ..things are now on my mind. I'm
thinking, what the fuck is going on? Is there such a fuckin'
fuck up this whole thing was? That, is it going to bite everybody
in the ass?"
B97 Burns gives a non-inculpatory explanation of
alleged physical evidence.
Al: "Hey, obviously you fuckin' aren't gonna fuckin' play
straight with me."
Al then asks more specific questions.
B107 Al asks more specific questions about the crime.
B108 Burns asks Al to look for reports on rafay,
and Al responds "Okay so he was fuckin' there, don't, don't
don't play games." "You don't see what I'm saying when
you did these things, were you alone or not? A simple yes or
no because I'll tell you right now, I'm not gonna go down there
and start fuckin' looking for more files than I have to. When
you did these things were you alone, that's all I want to know?"
B109 Al: "Were you alone when you did this,
that's all I want to know? Like his fuckin' hair gonna be in.
the showers, too?"
Burns: "No."
Al: "Okay, that's all I want to know. See? Now I know, now
I've got something clear in my mind, okay. That's fuckin' simple.
Great. See I just want to get some simple answer so I can get
some..."
Burns: "I mean or rather I should say I know he had a shower
in a shower like a few days before, you know what I mean. Okay
so that's what I mean like that why I say check anyhow, okay.
'Cause like..."
Al: "Okay I'll ask you this- was he there when these fuckin'
people were killed? See what I'm saying? Like when you say your,
your hair fuckin' hairs on the bodies, am I looking for fucking
the report, report I read on you was so fuckin' black and fuckin'
white it's unreal. Now, do I gotta go him and start searching
other files there might be something else on him, that's, see
what I'm saying?"
Burns: "Yeah I know."
Al: "Now was he there or did you just, just answer me this,
did you do this alone and I'll know what I'm looking at."
Burns: "Come on man!"
Al: "Why don't you answer my question, I just want a yes
or no and then I'll forget about it and then I'll know I won't
go after seven thousand files. A simple yes or no is going to,
answer me right if it's going to clear up my mine."
B110 Burns says that Al should check on a file for
Rafay because Rafay had a shower there a few days before. Al
replies "Other words he wasn't and you were there alone."
Burns repeats that Al should check. Al later says 'I... I got
a lot of things on my mind, unanswered questions, obviously you
don't want to answer me..." "Well then he goes through
all this other process and fuckin' finds out that he wasn't,
then who do I look like there a real fuckin' invisible o'tcol
that goes with sending, that goes with sending people in the
dark."
B112 Al: "Okay but were you alone or not, that's
all, answer that fuckin' question I'll answer once in my mind,
i.e. what the fuck I'll be looking for." "...'Cause
one time I think and then you give me this then I think this.
I just want a fuckin' answer, I..." "I don't need to
hear any grey shit, that's what I'm saying." "When
I leave here I don't want, any grey shit."
B113 Al: "Now forget these fuckin' games and
everything else.... If I go in there and ask only fuckin' grey
questions, and he comes back and says uh, here's what I got and
I don't know the answers then I've been fuckin' snowed, see what
I'm saying?" Burns argues that the forensic interpretation
of the events is the only important fact and that it may not
correspond with the actual crime to which Al says, "Well
whatever, when I ask you a question you can't answer it, I don't
need this fuckin'..."
B114 (continued from above) Al: "You answer
in this fuckin' computer wizard fuckin' language." "The
answer is yes or no."
B115 Al: "... I tired hearing about why you,
what to ask him, 'cause I fuckin' know what to ask him, I don't
want to to (sic) in there fuckin' grey when I ask for a simple
fuckin' thing on someone else, and I can't fuckin' given the
a fuckin' think like yeah, he's fuckin' uh, he was there to find
out exactly, to pursue it fuckin' further so you know exactly
what they got about him." "So, I want an answer yes
or no..." "I'm, acting like fuckin', what the fuck
are they gonna find. You're saying they could find hair from
five fuckin' days ago, well that's fucking great. The report
I read fuckin' puts you there. You know that, I know that."
B116 After Burns's repeated suggestions that Al should
check for police files on him and Rafay... Al: "Okay but
I want to know, did you do this alone or not? See you're looking
at me and thinking, why the fuck. should I... 'cause I want to
know because I'll tell you now, if this guy comes back to me
and says uh, no there's..." "And I leave here with
a clear fuckin' mind I know exactly I'm fuckin' lookin' after
one guy's ass to protect or we go to the fuckin' lab, there's
one guy fuckin' being looked after I'm not fuckin' uh, protecting
fuckin' three guys, two guys or one guy, I'm protecting you."
"...if
he ends up going down 'cause I missed something [Burns will go
down, and inform on Al]" "I want to know right now
- yes or no?"
Burns: "Yeah, check on him."
Al: "Yes, I'm gonna check on him, but I want to know yes
or no." " 'Cause I'm gonna be checking on him a lot
fuckin' finer, I'll be checking out fuckin' looking at fuckin'
DNA so it's mixed up with that fuckin' uh, blood in the shower
and everything else..."
B117 Burns: "...you don't have to check on him
a lot finer but urn, do a check anyhow, okay, and that's the
end."
Al: "Yes or no? Don't." " . ..I only asked you
a fuckin' question, don't fucking play fucking round-about games
with me, you know. I ask questions because I fucking want to
have clear answers to fucking look after..." "..one
phone call and I can say fuckin' forget about everything and
I'm walking out of here and so are they are... don't fucking
sell me short..." ("and don't ever let your fuckin'
friends start selling me short, 'cause you start selling me short,
you'll be in the (INDECIPHERABLE) hurt....")
C9 Al: " . ..there's uh, things here that
can be done very fucking quickly and very easy things, but they
gotta be done quick. But you're gonna want to do them, you're
gonna have to tell me you want them done, and you're gonna have
to play straight with me, 'cause things are fuckin' happening
quick here now... And, there's too many questions that are unanswered
here right now... It's your call, there's too many thing that
are unanswered right .now....So..." "...What I'm saying
is a lot of things are not answered, or answered here..."
Cl2 Al asks specific questions about the crime which
require inculpatory answers and says "I don't believe they're
sending a report to the lab or wherever this report is asking
to fabricate fuckin' evidence" after Burns suggests that
the evidence might be fabricated.
C13-14 Al: "I'll tell you why it (Burns's non-inculpatory
and hence, to Al, incomplete explanation oft the evidence) doesn't
stand as far as I'm concerned." "...I had someone doing
some checks for me, pissed off when he comes out, next thing
I know this fuckin' guy gets a hold of me, I'm meeting him, he
shows me this. He says look, he's supposed to be looking for
a few fuckin' hairs and anything else, and he comes up with..."
"...and then he comes , and he comes up with this stuff
here and he says hey unless I better what I'm looking for he
says you better fuckin' come down here and fuckin' give me the
facts cause I'm not fuckin' lookin' no more and uh, so now these..."
Cl5 Al: "I'll tell you why [a specific detail]
matters, because forget about what the fuckin' police have in
these reports for right now. What we have to deal with is getting
this stuff out of the lab." " . ..I'm not gonna risk
first of all anything with me, without knowing what I'm doing
anymore, and obviously there's another person that I'm looking
after one thousand percent here and it's fucking not gonna fuckin'
do anything for me unless he's got fucking everything he knows
he's looking for. Like could you imagine if we went to the lab
and just changed some things around and all of a sudden we're
fuckin' uh, dealing with some fuckin' uh, red fabric hairs that
we didn't find?" "So I want to know right now."
Cl6 Al: "So. tell me what went on down there
and I'm gonna tell you how I'm gonna take care of your problem....
Give me the straight goods, so I know exactly what I gotta take
care of. Now if something else needs taking care of I'm gonna
need your help. Start."
Cl7 Al asks for extremely specific information and
Burns answers with supposedly incriminating information and inculpatory
remarks. "Confession" begins.
C28-29 Al asks questions about the specific details
of the crime which require
inculpatory answers. After one such answer, Al says: "Well
fuck see I didn't know that either. See fuckin', you're holding
fucking things out on me..." "But I gotta know this
stuff, 'cause if all of a sudden uh, someone says to me down
there fuck I got this report where they found a pair of jeans
in a fuckin' dumpster, I'll think holy fuck..." " It's
little details like that are gonna fuck us up in the end. You
see what I'm saying, you see why I get a little pissed off?"
C29 Al (continuing): "'Cause I can't afford
fuck ups."
7. BURNS MUST
CONFESS FOR TRUST.
Transcript excerpts that show
that Al will not trust Burns and Rafay unless they explicitly
confess and that Burns and Bafay are only trustworthy if they
are guilty. This section includes all excerpts that establish
that Al trusts Burns in non-arrest circumstances only because
he's convinced of Burns' guilt. (If the case is that Burns is
to be arrested, he is, of course, necessarily not trustworthy
as per section 2.) This prevents Burns from making any further
concerted attempts to persuade Al of his innocence, and
although these are not necessarily instances wherein Al insists
that Burns confess, they do prevent Burns from revealing his
innocence when Al insists on being given conclusive explanations
about the crime. This section also includes the numerous excerpts
that document Al's demands that Burns confess so that Al can
trust him.
A25 Gary: "...I mean you
weren't being honest with me then and, and I can understand why
and I, you know you weren't being as honest as you are now and
uh I'm not gonna put uh you know, in one end you gotta put your
foot forward, you gotta take the chance before I take the chance.
But you've uh taken a bit of the step to show some trust..."
Burns has mentioned at this point that he's being investigated
for "a fairly serious offence." Gary seems to be implying
that Burns is guilty, and that his mentioning the investigation
is the first step towards his confessing and thereby establishing
honesty and
trust.
A30 Burns continues to refer to the accusations
in very general terms in an explanation of his disinterest in
committing crimes for Al and Gary, and, indicating innocence
of the charges, remarks that the police always presume guilt.
He attempts to conclude that he would prefer not to work for
Gary and Al, to which Gary says fl . ..but I sense something
untrustworthy here uh you know."
Burns: "Well I explained further then I..."
Gary: "Well, it's not a matter of explainin' further, it's
a matter of uh, it's a matter of fuckin' uh trust. But that's
what's the matter with is. Like I don't give a fuck what it is,
but the fact that you're that, you're reluctant and I can see
why you're reluctant. But that has me wonderin', thinkin' that
maybe I should be reluctant too." Gary seems to be saying
here that Burns is being dishonest for not confessing. Burns
has already stated his disinterest in working for Gary and Al
and as such Gary's suggestion that he should be "reluctant
too" contains sinister implications. Gary has, by this point,
confessed himself to having committed murder and to having a
witness murdered.
A47-49 Burns attempts to obviate his obligation to
commit crimes and to prove his trustworthiness by suggesting
that in the future he would like to give money to Al and Gary
so that they could invest it in their criminal enterprise. Gary
eliminates this escape by saying that the same trust must exist
regardless. Gary remarks that many friends are not trustworthy,
to which Burns says, "Fortunately I've had enough things
to uh eliminate anyone I don't trust man." Gary eliminates
this escape also by asserting that this cannot be known to be
true unless he and his friends are together guilty of a crime.
A52-53 Burns states that murder and crime in general
would not bother his conscience but that he would not wish to
participate in any crime or any murder because of his incapacity.
Gary objects, asking Burns how he would know that it would not
bother him. Burns remark about his comfort with Gary's activities
would seem to have been an opportunity for Burns to have gained
Gary's trust, but Gary has essentially said that Burns cannot
earn his trust unless he has committed a murder.
A69 Al asks Burns to tell him about the crime and
explains that he wants to know about it because "I just
wanta be sure I'm talking to someone who's fuckin' trustworthy."
Al indicates his assumption that Burns is guilty.
A79 Al asks Burns whom he'll give up when arrested,
and then says "Well, you're looking at him, that's what
I want to be fucking sure..."
A80 Al reiterates that Burns would inform on Al
and when Burns denies this Al asks him repeatedly about the crime.
A84 Al: "I just want to fuckin' see if you're
competent, cause Gary told me, you had some concerns and I just
want to be sure auh, you concerns are gonna cause fuckin' problems..."
"I did a little fuckin' checking, some research, whatever,
found out lots about you. And uh, I don't know, I found out a
lot."
A91 Gary makes a largely indeciphered remark about
not getting the whole story.
A11/53 Al: "Sebastian, I know what you didn't
tell me. I don't give a fuck! I don't gave a fuck! That's why
it's a not a fuckin' act! I don't give a fuck what you know!..."
A17/53 Al : "But I'm not sure that if you can
fuckin' trusted." Burns attempts to reply but then Al says
It... I don't believe you guys offed that family for sixty fuckin'
thousand dollars, on a fuckin' house..." thereby asserting
his presumption of Burns's guilt, and indicating that the possibility
for trustworthiness lies in being guilty of the alleged crime.
Burns responds "Well it's like I don't understand I mean,
I-I can tell you that I would never turn someone else in..."
A27/53 Al: "You did that murder..." "And
that's why you're solid."
A29-30/53 Largely untranscribed portion seems
to document Gary asking if Burns has discussed the crime inculpatorily
and, to Gary's mind, honestly (thus trustworthily). Burns denies
this, and makes insolent remarks about their presumption of his
guilt, prompting Gary to instruct him to refrain from such remarks.
A30/53 Gary: "...I'm in the same situations at
that time but, I don't know man. Well fuck we're all... he fuckin'
blindsided me once, twice, now you're doing it once whatever.
I just, I just like dealing... you know and ah, somehow I'll
say one thing, and you say another thing but it ain't 52 cards
that's been fuckin' played over here. I don't know, and probably
you do..." Gary implies that Burns is guilty and is being
dishonest for not having confessed.
B68 Al: "...If I'm gonna go down there and
fuckin' look after you so you'll be able to work for me and make
me money, I wanna know... And that's what I gotta fuckin' know.
That's why I'm talkin' to you right here without Jimmy, me and
you, 'cause he's not named in the reports, you are. That's what
I say, you'll be the one that's lookin' after my business, not
Jimmy or anybody else. You can take care of business the way
you took care of it down there, you can always look after the
business I want looked after. But I cannot fuckin' do it without
having you on my side so that if one thing happens I'm looked
after. Now what the fuck went on down there so I can go look
after everything fully?..."
B69 Al asks Burns how his hair came to be in the
shower mixed with blood. Burns: "Well, I guess at some point
I must've been in the shower and, uh, at some point there was
blood in the shower and, uh,"
Al: "Forget about it fuckin', you're fuckin' makin' circles.
I didn't come down on last night's train. How did the dead people's
blood get in the fuckin' shower with your hair?"
B70 Burns asks Al how it will help for him to discuss
specific details if it will be of no practical assistance to
Al's endeavour to sabotage the case. Al: " 'Cause I'm asking
you." "If you can't tell me that then it makes me think
you're hiding other stuff..."
B71 Al asks Burns about the details, and Burns attempts
to persuade Al that Burns is trustworthy because of Al's power
to kill Burns whenever and wherever he chooses, and that lt is
therefore not necessary for Burns to provide the details with
inculpatory remarks. This would seem to indicate that Burns believes
Al will not trust him unless Burns confesses, and that for this
reason Burns attempts to persuade Al that he is trustworthy without
a confession. Al does not accept this.
B80 Al: "Answer me this. Why did you guys do
this?..." "Cause I just wanna know, I wanna know what
kind of guys I'm going to be workin' with... let's fuckin' worry
about you not goin' to fuckin'.jail, but why you do it is for
my peace of mind."
B81 Al persists in asking about the motive.
B83 Al: "I'll help you, but I won't help you
unless you fuckin' uh, don't play games with me 'cause I will
not be set,..." " . ..I will not be setup by anybody."
Burns: "(Sighs) Gees, I'm not setting you up!"
Al: "So just answer that question there." Here it is
spelt out clearly: Burns must say he committed the crimes, because
to do anything else is to "play games" and Burns has
already been told in certain terms that this is equivalent to
setting Al up, something that will not be allowed to happen.
B87 Burns gives a non-inculpatory answer to a specific
question. Al: "You ain't give me the straight goods here
Sebastian." "Okay stop the fuckin' bullshit there.
Stop the bullshit there. Right now you're all but fuckin' lying
to me."
B88 Burns: "I'm not goddamn lying to you."
Al: "You are fuckin' givin' me this song and dance and everything
you just told me. That you told me last time I talked to you
that, which I don't know fuck all about. You come back and found
these fuckin' bodies. You found them, the report I fuckin' read.
Fuckin' basically spells out black and white. That, the police
fuckin' know you killed these people... So I'm not gonna have
this bullshit, you lying to me now, or fuckin' uh, you come back
and found these fuckin' bodies. You must think I come down on
last night's train. The minute you start thinkin' that about
me..."
Burns: "Holy Christ,"
Al: "And this fuckin',..."
Burns (later): 'I... To be civil, tell your friends check to
see if there was any blood on the fuckin' clothes."
Al: "You be civil with me. Don't fuckin' lie to me. Don't
take me for a fuckin' stupid man."
Burns: "I'm not takin' you for a stupid man."
Al: "You're always started tellin' me you come back and
found these bodies that I fuckin' know for a fact..." Burns
says that the evidence is not compelling, but that it is worthwhile
checking if it could be misrepresented as incriminating.
Al: "Don't be a smart ass with me man."
B89 Al: "'Cause I'll just walk away from this
in a fuckin' heartbeat. If I don't fuckin' like the feeling of
it." "And I won't fuckin' care of fuckin' Sebastian
BURNS." "[If you want my help] Then fuckin' start comin'
straight forward with me."
B91 Al: "...You're not answering my questions
and that's what's botherin' me."
B95 Al: "Well for some reason you're holding
back on me and I don't know why." Burns tries to convince
Al that the questions he resists do not matter.
B96 Al: "And [I want know] why you killed them.
And why your partner's, got no fuckin' thing against him that
I read. . . . . I'm thinking what the fuck is going on? Is there
such a fuckin' fuck up this whole thing was? That, is it going
to bite everybody in the ass?" Al proceeds to ask several
specific questions that would require inculpatory answers.
B97 Al: "Hey, obviously you fuckin' aren't
gonna fuckin' play straight with me."
B101 Al: "No, no this can be answered 'cause
it's fuckin' you can answer cause I wanna know. I will, it'll
be on my on my fuckin' mind lots. Why did you do this? Answer
me that fuckin' thing. I just wanna know, just wanna know it's
on my mind. Was it for money? Tell me, it's so fuckin' simple
answer just tell me that. It's not as though I know you fuckin'
did it. You know you did it. The police even fuck know you did
it. We'll take care of the police, uh I wanna know for the peace
of fuckin' mind." Burns emphasizes that he's not a "weirdo"
while providing a non-inculpatory answer.
Al: "That doesn't answer
my question Sebastian." "Well give me is give me a
black and white answer that I can understand." " ..if
it's my fuckin' mind then I can do my job and do what I gotta
do. That's want I wanna know."
Burns: "Do you wanna know
if, I'm ambitious for money in my life?"
Al: "No, I wanna know
why you killed these fuckers.
Chronological
Master List of Significant Entries (page one continued)
Chronological
Master List of Significant Entries (page two)
Chronological
Master List of Significant Entries (page three)
|
Truth can never be
told so as to be understood, and not be believ'd. William Blake, The Proverbs of Hell